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Subject: RE: XPATH query Take 2
The work done in LDAP is certainly interesting, but what about something like QUILT. AFAICS, QUILT uses XPath-like syntax which is useful on the document level context while adding functionality to bring it into the same space as SQL. JP: When you say "root context" what do you mean exactly? Cheers, Matt <<| message from: JP Morgenthal <jp.morgenthal@xmls.com> |>> Hello All, > > I am very pleased that some have seen merit in my argument, however, I would > really appreciate it if someone could identify for me the hesitation to > ignore the work of the LDAP specification. To my understanding this is a > well accepted standard and has a query facility. I'm not saying this is the > right direction for us, but it does fit what we are trying to do and is an > existing standard. > > There is the issues of extensibilty, and that's where the ebXML Reg/Rep > group could really assist in enhancing an existing standard to support eBiz > repository functions. > > Until we explore LDAP, however, I don't think we should legitimately look to > technologies that do not immediately suit our needs, such as XPath. Again, > the point was widely overlooked in my last e-mail that XPath only works > against a single root context. How are we to reconcile this root context? > XPath has considerable problems allowing users to easily differentiate loops > (consistent types serially declared as siblings). > > Come on people. Let's put on our thinking caps here and make sure we select > technologies that are easily implemented and will not require man-months of > rework to make useful. > > Thanks. > > JP > > -----Original Message----- > From: David RR Webber > To: duane > Cc: 'mrowley@exceloncorp.com '; 'RegRep ' > Sent: 1/6/2001 1:15 PM > Subject: Re: XPATH query Take 2 > > Message text written by duane > >First off I apologize for not getting involved earlier inthis thread. > I > have been in the Alps. > > This point made by JP is paramount and outlines my earlier concerns > dating back to May of this year. There must be no processing done on an > XML document instance on a Registry Server. The overhead will kill > ebXML. The registry is a place to find a document instance. All post > query overhead must be assumed on the users app. > <<<<<<<<<<<< > > Duane, > > Welcome back - I hope your yodelling has improved and the > vegetarian food was palatable. > > I have to take you to task here. There are two conflicting world views > on the TA for ebXML - and you are extolling the V2.0 one here, not the > version 1.0! > > The initial registry model calls for registry interaction to > predominately > occur prior to runtime. Therefore support for discovery is important, > and that processing WILL occur on the server. It will not be high > volume > due to lower user count. Even in V2.0 the server will be king. In a > loosely > coupled model you cannot expect all the clients to have installed > software > suites - that's what hamstrings CORBA. > > Local caching of result sets is the answer to high thru put - not > crippling > server functionality. > > Anyway - we do however arrive at the same place, and the point that > JP makes I would reinforce. > > > 3. We need to be careful as a group not to imply ANY implementation > detail > > for registries. OQL implies that the data is stored in a fashion that > > supports algebraic joining. We need to institute and interface that > is > > clearly implementation independent. Again, I think we need to look at > the > > work of the LDAP group as an excellent example of this. > > > > That's my story and I'm stickin' to it! :-) > > > > Regards All, > > JP > > We cannot prejudge at this point peoples implementations. We live in > a multi-faceted technology world. Registry servers will need to > support > a variety of interactions. Simple XPath derived for certain actions, > then > more sophisticated above that. Sun wants to choose OQL. Good luck > to them on that. I personally think this will limit access to XML > content > down the pike - but for now I'm sure they can engineer something that > will work. Engineers are resourceful as the XPath 'team' demonstrated. > > Others are looking at the W3C Query work as the way forward. My > recommendation is we do NOT lock ourselves into a corner at this > point. We can easily create an extensible query mechanism with > support for future syntaxes and a sub-set interoperability too. > > <query method='XPath' > action="returnlistURIs" > classification="\some\query\parameters" > locator="\specific\instance\criteria" > mode="allInstances" > transformation="none" /> > > Ooops - sorry - we are not allowed to think such thoughts as we > don't have time anymore to consider alternate approaches. > > For yet another example - see DTD's and Schema. We started > with DTD's and now GCI are using Schema for parts. > > Look at TRP they face exactly the same problem - except in > their space they have wire formats. MIME or SOAP/XP? > > Solution? They are allowing for both - MIME is first pass, > SOAP/XP is waiting in the wings. > > We should do XPath right now, and then see as our understanding > improves with early large implementations, and W3C finishes > both SOAP/XP and their Query work what makes sense then. > > History sometimes teaches you useful things. > > DW. > > <<| end message from JP Morgenthal <jp.morgenthal@xmls.com> |>> -- Matthew MacKenzie VP Research & Development, Founder XML Global Technologies, Inc.
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