Re: What the ? is happening to ebxml, and where the ? is it going ?

[shodZ <shodhan.sheth@gmail.com>]

im with david. ebXML is becoming just too complex, without delivering
teh real promises. i did rather put my bet on GXA(Global XML
WebServices Architecture) now, which is being co-authored by
Microsoft(majority) and IBM. atleast it is based on standards which
have been really tested out there in the market(yeah man, i`m talking
about SOAP)

On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 10:05:51 +1000, david.lyon@computergrid.net
<david.lyon@computergrid.net> wrote:
> 
> I've been following ebxml for a few years now, and just reflecting the comments
> of others, I too am wondering where ebxml is going ?
> 
> So far, most of the implementations that I've seen require somebody with a list
> of degrees and maybe a phd to setup, install and run. That's ok if ebxml is
> going to be simply an academic pursuit.
> 
> But in the real business world, things are somewhat different.
> 
> After the hype of dot coms, business is bustling away, and looking for good
> tools and new things. Companies are spending on IT again.
> 
> ebxml history gives the strong impression of being just the part-time hack of
> some good engineers but in the end, it never worked. There is nothing wrong
> with that.
> 
> I'm wondering if there is any 5 year plan for ebxml ? and where to next ? and
> what about addressing the real needs of the people, how to use it to get
> customers to pay money for it etc. These things seem a long way off and yet
> these are the things that are really important to most of the people that I
> know.
> 
> Regards
> 
> David
> 
> Quoting Rick Marshall <rjm@zenucom.com>:
> 
> > i haven't been able to get into ebxml yet because i don't think it has
> > yet really solved the problems of edi. and this is very relevant to the
> > soap/uddi people.
> >
> > the problem with edi is that it is a huge standard encompassing just
> > about every aspect of electronic trading and can cope with just about
> > every trading relationship. which means 90% (my guess) of it is not
> > needed in any particular trading instance.
> >
> > so industry trading groups sit down and agree on which parts of the
> > standard they will use, and how they will use them. typically the
> > largest purchaser in a trading group will dominate and determine how
> > these things will be done.
> >
> > then everyone else sits down with interpreters and tools and makes sure
> > they can interpret the necessary bits correctly.
> >
> > as an aside, there's a lot of redundancy in many of the message formats too.
> >
> > it also forces everyone to learn how to deal at the most complex level.....
> >
> > i have yet to see any evidence that ebxml has made this simpler, or
> > indeed can make it simpler. i can't see how it reduces the trade group
> > needs to negotiate the semantics of the messages, the specific use of
> > different terms. and now before you can even start to interpret messages
> > you need to fully describe your business model.
> >
> > i reckon the horse has become a camel, and like the camel now has it's
> > own evolutionary path.
> >
> > the good news is that it takes so long for multi-billion dollar trading
> > groups to move core technologies i'll probably retire before i have to
> > face the reality of this one.
> >
> > rick
> >
> > bry@itnisk.com wrote:
> >
> > > Whenever one examines one of the ebxml specs or reads an article on the
> > subject
> > > there is likely to be a reference to how edi had problems with being
> > accepted
> > >because it was too complex, but luckily ebxml, being based on xml, solves
> > all
> > >this. A very suspect class of assertion it seems like to me. I'm wondering
> > if
> > >anyone who has familiarity with these technologies can clarify exactly how
> > and
> > >in what ways ebxml reduces the complexity of edi.
> > >
> > >Basically my understanding is that ebxml just wrapped the edi model in xml,
> > so I
> > >have a hard time seeing how it could be simpler.
> > >
> > >Also am wondering about CPAs in Ebxml, it strikes me that this process
> > could
> > >actually be somewhat onerous, does anyone know of any case studies etc. on
> > >problems with making CPAs between two companies?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> >
> >
> 
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-- 
shodZ